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 Forum index » Activists » Animal Rights Talk
Joan Dunayer
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benio
Animal Guardian
Animal Guardian

Joined: 11 Feb 2008
Posts: 83
Location: France
Karin wrote:
I happen to think that reading books makes a difference.


I happen to know that there is a lot of books to read in the world, the most part of which have not been written by Gary Francione.

Quote:
You [David] have the right to remain what you are, a utilitarian.


As you have the right to remain what you are, a Liberal.

Quote:

that's the least damage being done to the movement for the abolition of animal slavery, part of which – one part among others – is the abolition of meat.


The defense of free-thought is one of the most useful things that can be done for the movement.

PostPosted: Today, at 12:12 am
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David Olivier
Animal Guardian
Animal Guardian

Joined: 23 Jan 2008
Posts: 69
Karin wrote:
David Olivier wrote:
That gives me no desire to read his books.

I know, David. I happen to think that reading books makes a difference. But you don't have to. You have the right to remain what you are, a utilitarian. That's fine. I mean, there seems to be nothing we can do about it.


Karin, you have no right to make it appear that I read no books. I said that I don't read his books. That I choose the books I am going to read, and that Gary's are not part of my choice.

Concerning utilitarianism: I've read a lot of stuff against utilitarianism; at least several books that were very anti-utilitarian. I have never found any substance in their arguments. You say there is nothing you can do about it. There might be a way: you could try to give arguments.

Karin wrote:
And if you find comfort in the idea that Gary is "running away" – from this forum in general, and from you in particular – that's the least damage being done to the movement for the abolition of animal slavery, part of which – one part among others – is the abolition of meat.


I'm not sure I understand your sentence here. But concerning Gary, yes, he does appear to be running away, out of lack of arguments. I find it incredible, but that is the way it seems to be. I don't think we have been extraordinarily brilliant in our criticism of him; we have just pointed out some blatant contradictions, factual errors and so on. It seems that to scare him away it is enough to just hold your ground!

Apart from that, if I understand correctly, you finally accept that you are part of the movement for the abolition of meat. So at least we have found a point of agreement.

David
_________________
http://david.olivier.name/

PostPosted: Today, at 12:35 am
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Karin
Animal Friend
Animal Friend

Joined: 06 Nov 2007
Posts: 31
 This is just for the record:

I was talking about "the movement for the abolition of animal slavery, part of which – one part among others – is the abolition of meat," not:... part of which is the movement for the abolition of meat. "Which" referred to "abolition," not to "movement". In other words:

I AM NOT PART OF THE "MOVEMENT FOR THE ABOLITION OF MEAT."

PostPosted: Today, at 1:05 am
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David Olivier
Animal Guardian
Animal Guardian

Joined: 23 Jan 2008
Posts: 69
Karin wrote:
I AM NOT PART OF THE "MOVEMENT FOR THE ABOLITION OF MEAT."


So now you don't want meat to be abolished? I am lost. Well, if you come back, we will sort it out some day. Very Happy

David
_________________
http://david.olivier.name/

PostPosted: Today, at 1:22 am
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